EX58-UD5 and 960 problems, please help

[qwertylesh]

Hi guys,
Im having trouble with this system and need help getting it stable.
the symptom is that only when running this cpu on this motherboard, it gets several kinds of bsods (0x..101 - low vcore, pagefault in nonpaged area) and it hard locks up with stressing.

Troubled system Specifications:

• EX58-UD5 (rev 1, bios F11)
• i7 960 @ stock
• 6gb Corsair 1600mhz Cas7 (7-8-7-20, 2T) ( CMP6GX3M3A1600C7 )
• Ati 5870
• Ocz fatality 700watt

tested with these parts:

• ex58a-ud3r
• i7 930
• 4gb kingston kvr 1066mhz cas9

test Conclusion

• System hard locks up with 960, any ram.
• But not with 930
• 960 does not hard lock up on other system

The problem is really odd, im baffled from it, when I use the 930 in the problematic system, its flawless, the tri channel cas7 ram is 100% stable and has no trouble what so ever, but when i use the 960, its got lots of stability issues.

also, if i use the 960 on another motherboard, its flawless, no issues with the IMC or anything what so ever.

I think the problem is related to the cpu's bios voltages and the cpu running at high clocks, Auto vcore and qpi/vtt works stable on the test motherboard, but not on the UD5 for this chip.

I'll include the most stable bios template I've been able to manage using the 960, and if anyone has any suggestions or can see any under-voltage, help will be greatly appreciated.
Its stable enough to get to the desktop without bsod, but hard locks up and is still no good with just this CPU.

Template:

Advanced CPU Features:
Intel(R) Turbo Boost Tech .................. [Enabled]
CPU Cores Enabled ............................ [All]
CPU Multi Threading .......................... [Enabled]
CPU Enhanced Halt (C1E) ................... [Disabled]
C3/C6/C7 State Support .................... [Disabled]
CPU Thermal Monitor .........................[Disabled]
CPU EIST Function ............................ [Disabled]
Virtualization Technology ................... [Enabled]
Bi-Directional PROCHOT ..................... [Enabled]


Uncore & QPI Features:
QPI Link Speed .............................. x44 (5.86Ghz/Gts)
Uncore Frequency .......................... [x25] (3.333Ghz)
Isonchronous Frequency ..................[Enabled]


Standard Clock Control:
Base Clock (BCLK) Control ................ [Enabled]
BCLK Frequency (MHz) .....................(auto - 133)
PCI Express Frequency (MHz) ........... [Auto]

C.I.A.2 [Disabled]

Advanced Clock Control:
CPU Clock Drive ..............................[800mV]
PCI Express Clock Drive ................... [900mV]
CPU Clock Skew ............................. [0ps]
IOH Clock Skew ............................. [0ps]


Advanced DRAM Features:
Performance Enhance ...................... [Standard]
Extreme Memory Profile (X.M.P) ......... [Disabled]
System Memory Multiplier (SPD) ........ [Quick]
DRAM Timing Selectable (SPD) .......... [Manual]

Channel A + B + C

Channel A Timing Settings:
##Channel A Standard Timing Control##
CAS Latency Time ....................[7]
tRCD .......................................[8]
tRP .........................................[7]
tRAS .......................................[20]

##Channel A Advanced Timing Control##
tRC .........................................[27]
tRRD .......................................[4]
tWTR ......................................[4]
tWR ........................................[8]
tWTP ......................................[19]
tWL ........................................[7]
tRFC .......................................[60]
tRTP .......................................[4]
tFAW ......................................[20]
Command Rate (CMD) ..............[2T]

##Channel A Misc Timing Control##
Round Trip Latency ...................[51]



Advanced Voltage Control:

CPU
Load Line Calibration ................. [Disabled]
CPU Vcore ...............................Auto (1.252v)
QPI/VTT Voltage 1.150v ............1.2950v
CPU PLL 1.800v .......................AUTO (1.800v)

MCH/ICH
PCIE 1.500v ...........................AUTO (1.500v)
QPI PLL 1.100v .......................1.200v
IOH Core 1.100v .....................1.240v
ICH I/O 1.500v .......................AUTO (1.500v)
ICH Core 1.1v ........................1.200v 

DRAM
DRAM Voltage 1.500v ..............1.66 (1.648v)
DRAM Termination 0.750v [AUTO]
Ch-A Data VRef. 0.750v [AUTO]
Ch-B Data VRef. 0.750v [AUTO]
Ch-C Data VRef. 0.750v [AUTO]
Ch-A Address VRef. 0.750v [AUTO]
Ch-B Address VRef. 0.750v [AUTO]
Ch-C Address VRef. 0.750v [AUTO]

Any help greatly appreciated.

[qwertylesh]

Re: EX58-UD5 and 960 problems, please help

update, I've found that the instability mainly lies with this 960, just when running HyperThreading.

Which leaves me even more freakin stumped, since a 930 can have HT enabled while running this Cas7 Ram, without issue whatsoever.

the only difference being this 960 has higher clock speeds, yet its so very unstable when HT is enabled, regardless of weather the ram timings and cas are tight or loose.

Im not comfortable bumping up the vcore or raising the QPI/Vtt over 1.350 to get it stable.
The problem I'm having is definitly HT related, and seems only with high frequency CPUs,
does anyone know what to adjust BIOS wise to improve the stability with HT enabled?

[GiggaByte]

Re: EX58-UD5 and 960 problems, please help

You do have a number of problems, or settings that most systems have a hard time with, even with low BCLK. Those settings in bold, change first, if no difference or got worse proceed to changing the rest. By what you said it seems enabling HT is creating alot of noise in the CPU.

None of these changes will cause harm to any components, for any reason if you think its a risk, simply don't change it, your system not mine.

-Put RAM ADV timing controls to AUTO, including round trip latency
-Put primary RAM timings to 8-8-8-24-1T
-Put PCI-E to 100MHz
-Put QPI Link speed to x36 (there is near no benefit for running a very fast QPI, it adds tremendous strain on the QPI bus)
-Put Uncore freq multi to x16 (Uncore MUST be a minimum of twice the RAM multi, usually the EXACT minimum is best)
-Put RAM freq multi to x8
-Disable turbo and set CPU multiplier to x19, you can try x20 but that multi creates alot of noise for many i7s (many, not all)
-Increase CPU Clock Drive to 1000mV
-Increase CPU PLL to 1.84v~1.86v, if no difference (not even a little) or makes it worse, reduce to 1.70v, if no difference or gets worse, reduce to 1.50v then 1.30v
-Put ICH core, IOH core, and QPI PLL back to stock

[qwertylesh]

Re: EX58-UD5 and 960 problems, please help

Thanks for the advice giggabyte,
I want to keep the baseclock on 133, and just get it stable at stock with the HT enabled.
the uncore at x25 is one notch above double the dram frequency.
the auto settings for those I've set manually since the auto setting is usually undervolted, the ICH core was raised because if its on auto the undervoltage causes trouble with the graphics card.

I actually lowered most of those voltage settings after discovering that the HT was causing the stability issues.

i lowered the IOH and QPI/Vtt by a few values and lowered the DRAM voltage to 1.6,
I decided to use the rams SPD instead of having the timings set tightly, which dropped the CL back to 11, it helped but I'll give CL 7 a try with HT off and that should work good.

I don't think the ram will run at cas8 with a command rate of 1T, 2T has less trouble and according to the JDEC and XMP timing tables the ram will only run at 1T at a very low frequency (1066)

all the advanced timings are set to auto already, I just entered what the auto value is in the template.

Hopefully increasing the clock drive and CPU PLL will fix the HT problem :)

with HT off the template is stable, even with the ram at 7-8-7-2T, none of the stability is ram related im sure of that because when the HT is off, the ram is perfect, it can super-pi on each core at 32m repeatedly and primes endlessly. only when HT is on does it hard lockup and bsod and playup.

since a 930 doesnt do this, im sure its related to the cpu volts, particularaly the vcore and the ppl and clock drive, but I wasnt experienced in setting these, i am fine with the ram config, its good how it is atm, I might drop the uncore back to x24 (3.200ghz) but sometimes an odd uncore freq is better.

Since I dont work over the weekend I'll have to give these a try on monday, thanks once again, the advice is much appreciated.

I'll let you know how it goes.

BTW; theres no problem with having Turbo on, and the 960 will HT fine on another mobo, Im confident that I can get it all sorted since ive isolated what the instability is being caused by, I just need the help in configuring the processor to run proerpy with the HT enabled.

[GiggaByte]

Re: EX58-UD5 and 960 problems, please help

Must be a noise issue then, much like how my 920 can't run x20 multi at 200 BCLK (but does 211 BCLK and x19 perfectly). From experience on my end CPU clock drive and CPU PLL have a direct effect on noise in the CPU, let me know how it works.

[qwertylesh]

Re: EX58-UD5 and 960 problems, please help

Thanks dude :)
Definitely related to the higher clocks and HT, noise probably would be the culprit. I'll post results on monday

[warren300]

Re: EX58-UD5 and 960 problems, please help

with stock clocks you should run with turbo and multi threading without problems,just set ram/cpu/and qpi voltage manually,set ram timing and multi according to ram,i can run 3.8ghz with 1.18750(normal)cpu voltage/1.66 ram voltage and 1.30000 qpi voltage,with stock clocks try 1.66 ram/cpu normal voltage/qpi 1.250000 v.......if you mean cpu noise(squealing) disable eist and c1e in bios and use balanced power saving profile in windows 7.

[qwertylesh]

Re: EX58-UD5 and 960 problems, please help

yeah, i have no problem with my own personal UD5 and my C0 stepping 920, and initially when I assembled this UD5 + 960 system, it worked stable with HT on, but after a few days of use, when HT is enabled its severely unstable.
im sure its just a change in the voltage tolerances, theres nothing wrong with the mobo or cpu or ram, as ive thoroughly tested these in a separate i7 rig, its just thos UD5 doesnt what to run this chip stable anymore unless HT is off, which im sure a bump of the right voltage should correct.

[qwertylesh]

Re: EX58-UD5 and 960 problems, please help

ok,
I tried out the suggested configurations, unfortunately they don't solve this problem.
the system is still very stable when HT is not enabled, however when enabled its still no good.

I did find that lowering the CPU PLL to 1.7v helped the stability mildly, but the system still hard locksup and crashes with it set like that.

:\

[qwertylesh]

Re: EX58-UD5 and 960 problems, please help

edit:
I was incorrect, turbo on or off doesnt change a thing, the problem only happens when HT is enabled.

[GiggaByte]

Re: EX58-UD5 and 960 problems, please help

Can you post the settings that did the "best" if you remember them? What CPU/IOH skews have you tried and are any of your BSODs 0x0000009c machine_check_exception?

[qwertylesh]

Re: EX58-UD5 and 960 problems, please help

I can post the template that worked with HT when it was on Bios F9 and very first assembled, about a week later it just was unstable with HT on:

All Fields Omitted, are set to Automatic Optomised Defaults.

> MB Intel M.I.T:
CPU C1E.......................[Disabled]
C3/6/7 State..................[Disabled]
CPU Thermal Mon...............[Disabled]
CPU EIST Funct................[Disabled]

> Uncore & QPI Features:
QPI Link Speed................[x44] (5.86Ghz)
Uncore Frequency..............[x24] (3.200Ghz)
Isochronous Support...........[Enabled]


> Advanced Clock Control:
Base Clock Control............[Disabled]
PCI-E Frequency...............[Auto] (100Mhz)
CPU CLock Drive...............[800mV] (auto setting)
PCI Express clock drive.......[900mV] (auto setting)

<MB Intel M.I.T
Peformance Enhance............[Standard]
XMP Profile...................[Profile1]
Memory Multi (SPD)............[Auto] (1600Mhz)

> Advanced DRAM Features:

DRAM Timing...................[Manual]
CAS...........................[7] (XMP SPD@ 8)
tRCD..........................[8] (XMP SPD@ 7)
tRP...........................[7] (XMP SPD@ 8)
CMD Rate......................[AUto] (2T)
Note: Banks B and C same as above.

> Advanced Voltage Control:

Loadline.......................[Disabled]
CPU Vcore......................[Auto] (1.25625v)
QPI/Vtt Voltage................[1.215V]
CPU PLL........................[AUto] (1.800v)

>>> MCH / ICH
PCIE...........................[Auto] (1.500v)
QPI PLL........................[Auto] (1.100v) <- May need raising to 1.2v
IOH Core.......................[Auto] (1.100v) <- Can be raised up to 1.2v
ICH I/O........................[AUTO] (1.500v)
ICH Core.......................[1.200v] (1.100v)

>>> DRAM
DRAM Voltage...................[1.66v]
DRAM Termination...............[Auto]
----

> Standard CMOS Features:
Drive A........................[None]

> Advanced BIOS Features:
HDD S.M.A.R.T..................[Enabled]
Init Display First.............[PCIE x16-1]

> Intergrated Peripherals:
SATA RAID/ACHI.................[AHCI]
SATA Port0-3 Native............[Enabled]
USB Keyboard...................[Enabled]
USB Storage....................[Disabled]
Onboard SATA/IDE Device........[Disabled]

> Power Management Setup:
ACPI Suspend Type..............[S3(STR)]
Soft-Off by PWR-BTTN...........[Delay 4 Sec.]



PC Health Status:

VCore...........................1.236V
DDR15...........................1.648V
+5V.............................5.053V
All Settings Including smart fan control Disabled

it was fine like this since assembly for over a week then the HT just stopped being stable.
I don't see any configuration that will let it run with HT enabled, without playing around with the bclk/multi and skews (which Im not keen on doing).

the main BSOD it got was 0x00000101, and most of the time, it would suffer hard lockup anywhere with HT enabled, and occasionally it would halt at the windows log in screen for a minute then the screen would go completely black.

the most bizzarre part is with HT disabled, its rock solid, it will linpack even without any residual norm discrepancies whatsoever. :S