EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

[Moph]

Hi,

I installed an EP35 DS4 yesterday morning and have been having major issues with it ever since.

First problem was it wouldn't post. All other components (HDD, case fans, optical drives) fired up but there was no video, no power to USB, and no power to CPU fan. However on turning the computer off the CPU fan did 'kick' slightly, indicating that voltage was available to the board. The Phase LED's were all lit up also.

Worked on it for quite a while, reset CMOS several times, took the battery out for 5 mins etc, no joy. Got exasperated, left the battery out and power pulled out and went to lunch. Came back and it fired up. Startup problems have been intermittent ever since though. Approx 1/10 startups from cold boot it will get to memory check, restart, get to memory check, restart, etc several times until it eventually works.

Have tried using M.I.T. to adjust RAM voltage to manufacturer's spec, and to bump FSB. No matter what settings I put in, whether I change just FSB and leave everything else on Auto, or whether I manually input every setting, when I save to BIOS and restart, the computer gets to memory check, glitches, restarts, and loads up the stock BIOS settings again. I cannot overclock, underclock, change voltages or use any of the features of the M.I.T. menu. Even 1GHz raising/lowering of FSB is unsuccessful.

I of course have all power saving / auto overclocking features (CIA2, C1E, etc) turned off.

Relevant system info is:
Antec P182 Black | Gigabyte EP35-DS4 | Intel Q6600 | Leadtek 9800GTX | Zalman HP850 PSU | Corsair TwinX DDR2-800 C5 | high end air cooling | 3xWD 640GB HDDs

Tomorrow (Monday) is the last day on which I can return the board under DOA warranty and I think I will do so, but thought I'd check here for a solution first.

I have tried all the standard solutions of flashing to F3, leaving BIOS battery out for an hour, disabling Legacy USB Support, unplugging all USB devices, using single sticks of RAM in different slots (and trying both sticks in case one is a dud). No luck. RAM pasts full run of Memtest86 at stock speeds also so shouldn't be an issue. CPU is Prime stable for 6 hours (using all 4 cores) at stock speeds so again ain't the issue here. It really looks like it's a fault with the motherboard hardware or firmware.

Anything else I can try before I DOA it?

Thanks,
Moph

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

But if you dont want or cant afford compatible ram then you should RMA

[Moph]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

Thanks for your quick reply Lsd.

Unbelievable! :rolls eyes: It would be lovely to see on either (or both!) Gigabyte's or Corsair's websites some information that there is a known compatability issue with this combination.

Do you know whether the problem is isolated to individual boards, or is it the entire EP35 DS4 range? To be honest I'm worried enough about the problems I've experienced so far that I think I'll be returning the board tomorrow regardless, but am I likely to run up against the same problem with a new board also? I can't say I'm keen on buying new RAM as there's nothing really wrong with the TwinX I've got, apart from this compatability issue, and I therefore doubt I'll be able to return/swap it.

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

If you want to post your settings I will glady see if I can see anything wrong. As you said TM2, C1E, C.I.A.2, EIST off correct? If so, post back your settings fro me and I will see if I see anything that is off in my opinion. Please post the settings you try that are not Auto

Just a template I use to ask people there settings, pay no attention to the numbers in it, replace with yours

Robust Graphics Booster___________ [Auto]
CPU Clock Ratio ____________ [8]
CPU Host Clock Control_ [Enabled]
CPU Host Frequency (MHz)__________ [450]
PCI Express Frequency (Mhz)_______ [102]
C.I.A. 2__________________________ [Disabled]
System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [2.00]
DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]
Performance Enhance = [Standard]

CAS Latency Time________________ ?
Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay_________ ?
Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_______?
Precharge Delay (tRAS)__________ ?
ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_________ ?
Rank Write to READ Delay________ ?
Write to Precharge Delay_________ ?
Refresh to ACT Delay______________ ?
Read to Precharge Delay__________ ?
Static tRead Value_______________ 1-31
Static tRead Phase Adjust________ 1-31

System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.300V]
PCI-E OverVoltage Control_ [+0.1V]
FSB OverVoltage Control___ [+0.1V]
(G)MCH OverVoltage Control [+0.1V]
CPU Voltage Control_______ [1.25]

[Moph]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

Cheers Lsd, and by the way your help is much appreciated. Excuse the typo in the OP also - 1MHz lower/raising of FSB was unsuccessful, not 1GHz Might have been a bit hopeful there...

Settings are somewhat irrelevant as it doesn't matter *what* I try ... changing any one or more of the values = doesn't work. But I'll show you what I tried for 'stock' manufacturer settings in Manual mode with a 1MHz lowering of FSB (this crashed).

TM2, C1E, CIA2, EIST off

Robust Graphics Booster___________ [Auto]
CPU Clock Ratio ____________ [9]
CPU Host Clock Control_ [Enabled]
CPU Host Frequency (MHz)__________ [265]
PCI Express Frequency (Mhz)_______ [100]
C.I.A. 2__________________________ [Disabled]
System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [2.00]
DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]
Performance Enhance = [Standard]

CAS Latency Time________________ 5
Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay_________ 5
Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_______5
Precharge Delay (tRAS)__________ 18
ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_________ 3
Rank Write to READ Delay________ 3
Write to Precharge Delay_________ 6
Refresh to ACT Delay______________ 42
Read to Precharge Delay__________ 3
Static tRead Value_______________ 4
Static tRead Phase Adjust________ [Auto] --->SPD says 0, which isn't selectable

System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.100V] ---> = 1.9V which is Corsair spec for SPD timings
PCI-E OverVoltage Control_ [+0.0V]
FSB OverVoltage Control___ [+0.0V]
(G)MCH OverVoltage Control [+0.0V]
CPU Voltage Control_______ [1.2875V]

Loadline Calibration________ [Auto] ---> no idea what this is...

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

No problem, thats why I am here. Although I am leaving in about 2 minutes so I hope this suggestion helps you tonight... Or you will likely RMA

I do see a few things wrong, they will be in BOLD with my changed suggestions

Robust Graphics Booster___________ [Auto]
CPU Clock Ratio ____________ [9]
CPU Host Clock Control_ [Enabled]
CPU Host Frequency (MHz)__________ [265]
PCI Express Frequency (Mhz)_______ [100]
C.I.A. 2__________________________ [Disabled]

System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [3.00] << set to whatever is closest to 800, or raise your FSB and get a bit higher. Well you know the deal, whichever your FSB is change this to be closest to 800. I think once you change the static tRead below you will have a MUCH easier time trying to change things

DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]

Performance Enhance = [Standard] << be sure to leave this on standard

CAS Latency Time________________ 5
Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay_________ 5
Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_______5
Precharge Delay (tRAS)__________ 18

All settings I post, start with the higher end for loosest testing

ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_________ 3 <<< 3-4 Put on 4 so we can see if this helps as well
Rank Write to READ Delay________ 3 <<< 9-11
Write to Precharge Delay_________ 6 <<< 3-5 so 6 is ok here
Refresh to ACT Delay______________ 42
Read to Precharge Delay__________ 3 <<< 3-5
Static tRead Value_______________ 4 << This is likely your largest issue. 6 can be done with great ram, higher volts and better ram quality (meaning better binned ram, such as 4-4-4-12 ram with 2.1V specs) I suggest you start at 7-10 mainly start with the higher settings I suggest then if you do get somewhere you can lower later.... So start with 10

Static tRead Phase Adjust________ [Auto] This should be left at Zero, Auto Or 1-31 any of which will be zero

System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.100V] ---> = 1.9V which is Corsair spec for SPD timings
PCI-E OverVoltage Control_ [+0.1V] <<< For Stability
FSB OverVoltage Control___ [+0.1V] <<< For Stability
(G)MCH OverVoltage Control [+0.1V] <<< For Stability

CPU Voltage Control_______ [1.2875V] I would go ahead and bump this up to 1.35 - 1.45 (If your cooling is good) just to rule out the CPU voltage is not the issue

Loadline Enable or not, what it does is make sure that what you set CPU voltage to in BIOS does not drop so much at load. There is always vdrop which is the voltage drop from what you set in the bios to what you get in windows at idle, this is vdrop.

Then there is vdroop (two oo's) this is the drop from what you set in the BIOS and eventually get in windows between Idle and Load. The loadline calibration makes the Load droop much smaller with it enabled then not.

Say you set 1.35 in the BIOS, with vdrop you may see in windows at idle 1.335. When at load you may see 1.31 with loadline disabled. With it enabled you may see less of a droop such as only down to 1.319-1.333

Kinda hard to explain, I hope you get that a little bit

Good luck on getting somewhere, or your RMA whichever you decide. Ill be back tomorrow if you do decide to keep the board and need more help.

[Moph]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

Thanks mate - your explanation of Loadline Calibration made perfect sense :)

Unfortunately your tweaking didn't help. Will return the board tomorrow and have another crack with a new one.

Thanks again for your help,
Moph

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

Anytime!

If you get the same board you will probably have same issues due to that ram. I suggest Mushkins if ya wondered

See you tomorrow if ya are around

[Moph]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

Okay, weirder and weirder.

Decided I'd have to take the board back for DOA replacement and pulled it out of the system.

Now that it was out and I had time on my hands, I decided to lap my CPU and TRUE cooler. Took a couple of hours lapping them and then realised I didn't want to be trying an untried recently lapped (and therefore possibly cooked!!) CPU in a new motherboard - too many unknown variables.

So back in went the motherboard, CPU, cooler, 1 stick of RAM, gfx. No SATA or other connections - minimum connections to get it to post. All went fine. Decided I'd try overclocking just for the heck of it - and the bloody thing worked!

Plugged all other components back in one by one (RAM, 2xoptical SATA, 3xHDD SATA, eSATA) testing OC on each installation. No problems.

So for whatever reason, reinstalling the thing has solved my difficulties. Can't for the life of me work out why as there was most definately nothing conductive stuck under the board in the initial installation, and I had already unplugged and replugged all power/SATA/etc connections as part of my earlier troubleshooting. Looks like the motherboard just wanted attention!

So now I have a fully functioning motherboard that I ran quickly up to 3.5GHz last night :) and is happily MemTesting my Corsair TwinX DDR2-6400 at 1020MHz as I type :) :) :) Tested stably at 999MHz for 6 hours last night.

No idea what the problem was, or how reinstalling fixed it, but problem solved.

[deVries]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

I had a stable overclock for days on a similar board, but now my settings were not "held" in Bios. I had to clear CMOS & reset settings to get back my overclock. Unfortunately, this is a common issue reading similar posts.

I'm giving-up until a Bios fix is admitted to for this issue. Apparently, tech-support is not acknowledging this needs to be fixed???

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

Superb!!!

Sounds like maybe you just had the CPU set in there a little bit off or something!

Glad to hear you are in business!!!

[Moph]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

--------UPDATE-------

Hmmm. Interesting. Shifted the case to it's final home beneath my desk last night and the problem reoccurred. Sat back and thought about it logically, and worked out that the only real variable that had changed was the unplugging/replugging of the same cables when it shifted position.

Tried overclocking and restarting with all cables in - no luck. Overclock in BIOS, save and restart, quickly unplug the single USB device attached (my mouse and keyboard dongle) prior to the motherboard powering back up again - starts correctly and retains all settings.

I *think* I may have an earth short at the IO shield or something similar that is destabilising the motherboard whenever a USB is plugged in (whether into rear IO ports or front case-mounted USB ports).

Will remove and reinstall the motherboard (again!) checking the IO shield carefully and report how I go.

Thought I'd update you so you'd know this may occur for others.

Cheers,
Moph

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

Hmm very strange! But ya it sounds like a short or something to me, did you test without this dual dongle? Maybe that has the short in it

[Moph]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

Yup - I tried a couple of G7 dongles, an MX Revolution dongle, and an old USB keyboard and mouse. Motherboard became unstable with all of them. Weird thing is its only at startup that this problem occurs - with all USB's unplugged, once the memory has checked successfully then you can plug the USB's back in and it works fine - until next startup.

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: EP35 DS4 won't retain any changes in M.I.T.

Hmmm... Maybe a bad USB port all together then?