Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

[Spyone1]

Hi yet again.

I have done some research looking for what temperatures would be considered normal before I attempt overclocking, to see if I need to address cooling before overclocking.
All the overclocking sites I can find give temperature results after actual overclocking, but not before.

My computer specs are listed. The system is using default BIOS settings for everything (voltage etc). i.e not overclocked yet.

Programs I have running are:
ASRock XFast LAN, AsRock XFast USB, Avast Professional, Driver Update, Aida 64 Extreme, IoBit Malware Fighter, IoBit Advanced System Care Professional, IoBit Smart Defrag, Google Chrome, Mozilla Thunderbird.
(Just so you know it isn't really under any load to speak of).

Temperatures I am getting are as below. I don't know if these are good or not. I do wonder why the VRM temperatures are 15-20 degrees C above anything else.



I forgot to mention, the room is a constant 21 degrees C, the case sits on the floor in the open, it currently has negative computer case pressure.

Cheers

[- wardog -]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

Temps don't look awful bad or anything compared to what I can find on the net.

What cooler you using? Therein lies the cats whiskers, does the cooler perform when given more heat to dissipate.

[Spyone1]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

TY.

Right now, the standard CPU cooling fan supplied when I purchased the CPU.
The case has 5 x 140mm fans (2 at the front, 2 at the top, 1 at the back).

The plan is to add a Corsair H80i water cooler mounted where the rear fan is now, and move the current rear fan to either the bottom of the case or the side of the case.

Is it normal for the VRM temps to be higher than anything else?

[- wardog -]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

The plan is to add a Corsair H80i water cooler mounted where the rear fan is now, and move the current rear fan to either the bottom of the case or the side of the case.

You best get a fan on those VRMs before the H80i. Whatever airflow that stock cooler is providing the VRMs will be gone once you put that H80i in there. Exacerbating the X79/LGA2011 high vrm temps.

This may sound counterproductive. As a test unpower the top front most fan and see if that alone changes the airflow inside your case with the side on. Might also try doing the same with the other top fan too if you see some results with just doing the one.

But do pay close attention to your temps and that of the VRM temps too while doing so.

[Spyone1]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

I did something even slightly more radical. I reversed the airflow of the two top fans, so they are blowing in to the case, not sucking air out. It gives me positive case pressure instead of negative and means more cool air is being blown in to the case at the expense of air extraction.

The results were immediate. At idle, (same programs as above running), the CPU temp dropped by 3 degrees (to 27), the CPU package dropped by 4 degrees (to 33), VRM1 dropped by 6 degrees (to 42) and VRM2 dropped by 5 degrees (to 42).
Strangely, the MB temperature itself has stayed about the same.

I then ran the AIDA 64 System Stability Test, on everything except local disk drives, for 20 minutes. I had just finished running Benchmark 8 before that which is why the VRM, MB and CPU minimums in the stability test are above what I just said above.

Results below. I have no idea what some of it means yet though, especially voltages and suchlike. Are the figures below okay for a non-overclocked system please?

[parsec]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

For using the stock cooler on an i7-3820, the core temps are not bad. But also note that CPU power saving features are enabled in the BIOS, since I see yours is idling at 1.2GHz, from the standard 3.7GHz as we can also see in the last screenshot.

Your load temps at 3.7GHz in the low 60's C is also good, but that won't last once an OC is applied.

The VRM temps are normally higher than the CPU temperature. They are different components not located on the CPU, they are under the heat sinks at the top of the board. They supply the appropriate voltage and power to the CPU. When you changed the fan direction, you were blowing air directly on the VRM heatsink.

Expect the VRM temps to get much warmer if you OC, since the VRMs are just a "6 + 2" design, and any OC will need more power and demand more of the CPU VRMs. Of course we don't know what MOSFETs are used in your board, they might be more robust than other boards. For example, my Z77 Extreme 4 board is a "8 + 4" design, although a detailed analysis done by a few enthusiasts deemed that to be false, as well as being an analog controlled design, not digital as claimed by ASRock. But all of that may not matter, as long as clean power is supplied to the CPU in the amount it needs, without the VRMs being overstressed and failing.

[Spyone1]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

Thanks Parsec

I have ended up with another concern, one with my GPU (well, the primary one anyway).
I did a load test on it last night using Furmark. On the 15 minute test the GPU diode got to 102 degrees C within 5 minutes, with the GPU at 99% and the fan at 100%. I stopped the test at that point.
I then did the 1080p test, and the GPU diode got to 88 degrees C by the end of the 1 minute test.

I kept the temp monitor going and disabled Crossfire whilst I went and played Final Fantasy XIV. The primary video card GPU diode temperature quickly went to 102 degrees C...and pretty much stayed there. It didn't drop below 98 degrees C the entire time I was playing, but didn't go over 102 degrees C.

I intend to remove that card and swap it with the other one to see if this temperature gradient is maintained, or if it is specific to that one card.

If that is the temperature experienced without an overclock, I shudder to imagine what will happen once I attempt to overclock. It may not be worth it???

[parsec]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

Sounds like you need more ventilation for the video cards. I have the same Fractal case as you do, and your board looks like there is some space between the video cards.

So you have five fans, let me guess, two in front, two on top, one in the top rear? Two pushing air in from the front, but now two pushing air in from the top, and one pulling air out at the top rear? Or what is the setup? What fans do you have?

Not enough exhaust in that case now, and not enough cool air getting to the video cards. If you can mount a fan on the side panel blowing air onto the video cards, that would help. You really should go back to using the top fans as exhaust, the VRM temps are not that bad until you reach ~60C+.

Set the fan speed controller to high, since all your HDDs are blocking air flow and not much cool air is coming in the front at all, with the front filter. I have the filter removed, but I don't mind cleaning dust. Filters restrict air flow a lot, at least 50%.

You could try using a fans on the side panel as exhaust and still use the two top fans as intakes. If you get the H80i, you'll need to decide to use outside air to cool the radiator, or internal case air. Outside air is cooler, but you then need to get the warmed air that passed through the radiator out of the case. That means going back to top exhaust fans.

No way should you OC the video cards, they are maxed out temp-wise. If you OC the CPU, even with a better cooler, if you don't get that hot air out of the case, things will only get worse. Also, the heat from the video cards heats the air in the case, and then that air is used to "cool" the CPU.

If the top card is at 102C, I doubt it's just the card. Heat from the card below it is raising its temperature.

The mother board temp sensor is usually at the bottom of the board, so the air from the top of the case won't have much if any affect on it.

[Spyone1]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

Thanks again. Just switched the fan controller to high

Good guess. Two at the front pushing air in, two at the top pushing air in, one at the rear pulling air out. All 5 of them are the FD 140mm fans (I bought 3 extras when I bought the case, same as the ones pre-installed).
I do have a spare 120mm fan I can mount on the side until I get the H80i and new CPU/MB/RAM in a month.

Too many (deleted expletive) items need to be cooled at once.

I was planning to use the H80i as an exhaust, pulling internal air from the case through the radiator. I was working on the theory that if I do it the other way, I will be pushing warm air in to the case.

I guess the plan then would be 2 pushing in from the front, 1 from the side, 1 from below (I will mount another fan just in front of the GPU), 2 exhaust at the top and 1 (H80i) exhaust at the back.

In the meantime, since obvioiusly overclocking is not an option, I will go back to the two top as exhaust. After all, it does everything I want it to do without the overclocking.

[parsec]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

The AIO coolers like the H80i are a bit of a challenge to configure, as intake or exhaust and what affect it has on other components.

Bottom line IMO, the heat from even an OC'd CPU with the AIO cooler's fans blowing into the case is much less than that created by two video cards. I have mine set up as intake, with two top exhaust fans pulling the radiator exhaust right out of the case. But I also do not run two video cards, or even one at high temps.

I have a fan on the bottom of the case, between the PSU and drive cage, pulling air in from the bottom. In your situation, the side vent should at least be open, even better with a fan. The only way to tell what works best is to experiment with the fans as intake or exhaust, and check the temperatures.

The FD fans are good fans, but running only up to 1000 RPM, they are not optimal for ultimate cooling. Then there is the noise factor, if you care or don't. I have all my fans on speed control, and turned way down for basic use. With them all at full blast, it is LOUD!

[profJim]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

The following fan specs are from the manufacturers' websites:

Corsair H80i
Radiator dimensions	120mm x 152mm x 38mm
Fan dimensions	120mm x 120mm x 25mm
Fan speed	2700 RPM
Fan airflow	77 CFM
Fan dBA	37.68 dBA
Fan static pressure	4mm/H20

Define R2 140mm case fans
	Low Speed	Normal Speed
Speed	800 +/-200RPM	1000 +/- 10%
Max. airflow (CFM)	52.8	66.0
Max. pressure (mm H2O)	0.54	0.84
Noise level (dBA)	14.9	18.5

For reference, my 120mm, 1600 rpm Scythe S-Flex case fans are rated at 63.9 CFM.

I will post results from my patented 2-sheet, dangling toilet paper deflection tests where I compare how much the paper deflects when it is held 2 inches away from the exhaust side of the Seidon 120XL and the S-FLex fans that are installed in my system.

My Cooler Master Seidon 120XL AIO water cooler has specs that are similar to the H80i's specs.
The H80i and the XL120 AIO cpu water cooling kits each have 38mm thick radiators and two fans for a push/pull setup.

CM Seidon 120XL
Radiator Dimensions	150 x 120 x 38 mm
Fan dimensions	120mm x 120mm x 25mm
Fan Speed
Fan Airflow
Fan Air Pressure
Fan Noise Level (dB-A)	19 ~ 40 dBA

[Spyone1]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

Thank you both for all the assistance, greatly appreciated, I believe I have found the problem.

Just on a hunch, I removed the primary video card, moved the second video card to the primary (so only one video card) and fired it up.
I didn't change anything else. Fans still in the 4 in, 1 out configuration, everything else the same as I listed earlier.
I ran the Furmark 15 min burn-in test on that card. The GPU temperature did not exceed 70 degrees C, and sat at 69 degrees C for 90% of the test. The GPU fan did not go above 50% and the test completed just fine.

Then I took the secondary video card out, put the primary back in (again, so only one video card), with the same configuration as previous, and fired it up again.
On the Furmark 15 min burn-in test, the GPU temperature hit 100 degrees C after 4 min 52 seconds. I terminated the test at that point. The GPU fan had been at 100% for about a minute.

Given that everything else was the same (acceptance tester here, I know about identical test beds) the only conclusion I can come to is I believe I have a RMA qualified video card....dammit!!

It is a good thing I asked (and you guys answered) about all this before I started playing with overclocking. God knows what I would have burned out if the video card tried to become a lava flow through my case.

[profJim]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

Cool (pun intended), glad to hear that you are making progress!!

[Spyone1]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

I found out what it was.

There is a little bundle of wires that run from the video card itself to the video card cooling fans. Two of them were shorting out, which meant the GPU cooling fans were not working properly (actually not working at all most of the time).

I took it back to POP, they test-bedded it, immediately diagnosed the problem, replaced the connection.

Brought it back home, reinstalled it. At the same time, I added to, and reconfigured, my computer fans.
2 x input at the front (140mm), 1 x input at the bottom (120mm), 1 x input at the side (120mm), 2 x exhaust at the top (both 140mm), 1 x exhaust at the rear (140mm).

Ran the Furmark 15 min Burn-In Benchmark (1920 x 1080) test. There is a warning about that test (it is really hard on the video card apparently) so I was somewhat apprehensive.
Max temp for the GPU was 73 degrees, a damn site better than it was 2 hours before....and it held that for the entire test.

I then bit the bullet, put the second video card back in, re-enabled XFire, ran the 15 min burn-in test again.
Max temp for the GPU, 79 degrees. I took a screenshot of the temps at the 10 minute mark. Again, it finished the test.



Much better than over 102 degrees.

Thanks heaps for the assistance guys. It made this much much easier, and I know not to bother with the overclock until I get the new CPU/MB/RAM/Cooler, and get 3 of the 4 HDD (and the HDD enclosure) out of the way.

[profJim]

Re: Pre-Overclocking Temps at idle before I attempt overclocking

Exactly how many hard drives are in your computer case?
Is there any outside cooling air getting past your hard drives from the front cooling fans?
Do you cook pizza inside your case?