Z77 Extreme 6

[Babdi]

Hello folks, my first post here.
I switched from AMD to Intel recently.
I have a AsRock Z77 extreme6 MB with I7 3770K.

Setup
1. I have connected the front panel USB to Grey USB socket (6 GB/s)
2. BIOS is 1.90
3. All drivers are updated.
4. OS Win 7 ultimate
Issues
1. USB pen drive is not seen in BIOS boot option
2. When I select 4.7 GHz from BIOS it does not show in AIDA64. It shows as 1600 or 3500 even under stress
3. Instant boot does not work. Re-installed a couple of times
4. MVP Virtu does not accept the GPU (nVidia 560Ti) and fails to launch Using the latest driver 304.79 (Beta). This could be a suspect

Any help appreciated
Thank you

[parsec]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

Hi Babdi, Welcome to the ASRock forums, you know me from somewhere else...

Questions, to quote you: I have connected the front panel USB to Grey USB socket (6 GB/s)

Hmm, the grey sockets are the SATA III connections, the top ones from the ASMedia chipset, the lower grey ones the Intel SATA III ports. Do you mean USB or eSATA? The USB 3.0 front panel connection on the mother board is just below the 24 pin power connector.

Please use the two Intel SATA III ports, the grey ones below the first grey stacked pair, which are provided by the ASmedia 1061 chipset, and are slower, and hard to boot from. I don't mean to use them for the front panel USB connections.

AIDA64 may be wrong showing the highest level of your OC.You must have SpeedStep enabled (which is fine) which lowers the CPU speed to 1.6GHz under low load. Did you set the Turbo multiplier to 47 by All Cores or Per Core? Did you try the ASRock XTU utility, which should show the correct CPU speed. The latest CPUz should too.

Frankly, going to 4.7GHz with an Ivy Bridge CPU will be difficult. I would try a multiplier of 42 first, and if you don't choose By All Cores, only one core is set to 4.2GHz. IB boards and CPUs are difficult to get above 4.5GHz, due to high CPU temperatures. DO NOT OC your IB CPU using guides for Sandy Bridge CPUs, they are similar but also different in some important aspects. What are you using to monitor CPU temperature?

Instant Boot requires a special partition on a drive to be created before the feature is enabled. If you use a SSD now, Instant Boot is a waste of time, it really is Intel's version of Windows Hibernate. I use Windows S3 Sleep, which is very fast and works fine. All these features are enabled by default in the BIOS/UEFI, which I disabled and don't use. Or at least get your PC stable first, and then try them. With all these different and new features, you really should check the manual.

MVP Virtu is still buggy and does not support all video cards. I would not use it, and I don't.

[Babdi]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

Hi Babdi, Welcome to the ASRock forums, you know me from somewhere else...

Questions, to quote you: I have connected the front panel USB to Grey USB socket (6 GB/s)

Hmm, the grey sockets are the SATA III connections, the top ones from the ASMedia chipset, the lower grey ones the Intel SATA III ports. Do you mean USB or eSATA? The USB 3.0 front panel connection on the mother board is just below the 24 pin power connector.

Please use the two Intel SATA III ports, the grey ones below the first grey stacked pair, which are provided by the ASmedia 1061 chipset, and are slower, and hard to boot from. I don't mean to use them for the front panel USB connections.

AIDA64 may be wrong showing the highest level of your OC.You must have SpeedStep enabled (which is fine) which lowers the CPU speed to 1.6GHz under low load. Did you set the Turbo multiplier to 47 by All Cores or Per Core? Did you try the ASRock XTU utility, which should show the correct CPU speed. The latest CPUz should too.

Frankly, going to 4.7GHz with an Ivy Bridge CPU will be difficult. I would try a multiplier of 42 first, and if you don't choose By All Cores, only one core is set to 4.2GHz. IB boards and CPUs are difficult to get above 4.5GHz, due to high CPU temperatures. DO NOT OC your IB CPU using guides for Sandy Bridge CPUs, they are similar but also different in some important aspects. What are you using to monitor CPU temperature?

Instant Boot requires a special partition on a drive to be created before the feature is enabled. If you use a SSD now, Instant Boot is a waste of time, it really is Intel's version of Windows Hibernate. I use Windows S3 Sleep, which is very fast and works fine. All these features are enabled by default in the BIOS/UEFI, which I disabled and don't use. Or at least get your PC stable first, and then try them. With all these different and new features, you really should check the manual.

MVP Virtu is still buggy and does not support all video cards. I would not use it, and I don't.

Thank you Parsec.
My USB now reads OK.
I checked with CPU Z. It still shows 3500 Ghz. I tried from 4.2 Ghz onwards and speedstep is disabled. Turbo multiplier is set to all cores.'Working on this.

I uninstalled instant boot and Virtu. I thought the same as you said in the post.
Don't have a SSD yet. Hope I win one here

[Babdi]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

Thank you Parsec.
My USB now reads OK.
I checked with CPU Z. It still shows 3500 Ghz. I tried from 4.2 Ghz onwards and speedstep is disabled. Turbo multiplier is set to all cores.'Working on this.

I uninstalled instant boot and Virtu. I thought the same as you said in the post.
Don't have a SSD yet. Hope I win one here

I did it. Set at 4600. Look at temp. I am stock cooler. you would know why ;)

[parsec]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

Honestly Babdi, when I realized it was you, and that you (an AMD person) had an Ivy Bridge CPU and board, I thought, "... Oh My Gosh, I don't think he will be very impressed with Intel...". In some important ways, Ivy Bridge CPUs are different than previous Intel CPUs, and are very different than Sandy Bridge CPUs, although they should be closely related.

The picture/screenshot of your CPU temperature turned out to be so small, given the tiny font, etc, that is used in this forum, that I cannot read it. I even made a copy of it to look at on my PC, but I still cannot read it. But I can guess that you cannot believe the very high CPU temperature you have at 4.6GHz. The temperature reading you are seeing is probably correct.

It turns out that Ivy Bridge (IB) CPUs run very hot at high over clocks, and even at idle. I am using an i5-3570K, and it is the hottest CPU I have ever used. Even at idle, with the CPU power saving option SpeedStep enabled, which clocks down the CPU to 1.6GHz, using a Corsair H60, the CPU temp is never below 30C, and is usually 35C. The good news is the core temperatures are the same or a bit lower than the CPU temperature, so you can monitor the single CPU temperature as a maximum. The other good news (??) is that IB CPUs like yours have the temperature where thermal throttling will activate set to 105C. Regardless, it is scary to see CPU temps of 75C and above. I don't like that either.

The other problem is the Intel stock cooler. Since your (and mine) IB CPU is rated to be a 77 Watt TDP (Thermal Dissipation Power) device, which is lower than any other high end Intel CPU (i7-3960X = 130 Watts, i7-2700K = 95 Watts, i7-990X = 130 Watts), the CPU cooler provided is very small. Intel does not focus on the CPU temperature itself, but whether or not a CPU cooler can dissipate a certain amount of heat. That is what the TDP specification is about, the maximum amount of heat from the device that must be removed by the CPU cooler in order to keep the CPU operating normally. AMD also uses a TDP specification for their processors. Intel does not expect a CPU to normally be operated at 100% load for long periods of time (more that a few seconds), so the CPU cooler is not designed for that circumstance.

Therefore, I see another H100 in your future Also, you will need to become comfortable with higher CPU temperatures than you have lived with in the past. I imagine this may be a trend in future processors, as they become smaller and include more functions on the CPU. For example, your IB CPU has a graphics processor, memory controller, and supplies the PCIe 3.0 lanes, as well as all the usual CPU functions. Then the actual "die", or processor chip itself is actually ~1/3 the size of the top of the CPU package, the part that contacts the CPU cooler, it is only 160mm², which is just over 1/2 the size of an AMD Bulldozer core, of 315mm². How do you draw heat away from such a tiny thing?

If you haven't seen this review of your CPU, it will enlighten you about it much more than I can:

AnandTech - The Intel Ivy Bridge (Core i7 3770K) Review

[Babdi]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

I bought 3770K after going through Anandtech and few other reviews. I am acutely aware of the heat problem. The ambient in part of the world I live is around 30 deg C. My idle sits at around 34 ~ 35 at 4600 which is impressive with stock cooler. The replacement H100 should drop a few more degrees.
I have not stressed the CPU yet. Want to see how it performs normally. Have not tried gaming either. The CPU is at 1.300 volts,which I am sure is high.A 1.2 V at 4.70, I feel should be good. I am getting used to Intel quirks . The RAM of 1600 is pushed to 1800 (XMP) at 1.600 volts.

I had to "Bulldoze" AMD for obvious reasons . Intel 's higher cost far outweighs AMD lower cost and abysmal performance.Besides Intel has high re-sale value here ( If I migrate to higher chips that is ). There are umpteen MB for Intel and few for AMD. India runs on Intel.

Though moving from FX8150 (which I had bought few months back) had bit my pocket I felt is worth it. A calculated wise decision I presume.

My aim is to hit 5.0 Ghz with H100 and with acceptable temperatures (not more than 80,however). I should be comfortable with ~35 at 5.0 Idle.Lets see

PS:
I far as I know there is a theoretical limit as how to how much you can pack transistors. Packing more densely will cause "leaks", electrons jumping over. They could squeeze to 22nm due 3D layering. Till now all the transistors were laid in X,Y axis. I believe in this CPU they laid in Z axis.

Also a minimum circuit layer thickness is a must,else will heat the circuit. A engineering challenge. Till they find a new material with better electrical and thermal properties 22nm is going stay for a quite a longer time.

[parsec]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

OH great, then you are fine with your idle temps, I was worried! I'm glad you like your IB PC, and yes, every CPU/chipset/mother board have their own little quirks. I am impressed you are doing that well with your CPU temps with the stock cooler.

I imagine that you also saw the Anandtech IB OC article, which is interesting. They seem to be very conservative with the CPU voltage, which is not a bad thing. Given what I have read, an OC of 5.0 on an IB CPU will be a challenge, and your mother board may be the limiting factor, if not the CPU. My ASRock Ex 4 and i5-3570K will BSOD at anything above 4.5GHz, but I did not spend much time adjusting things in the UEFI.

Good luck in your quest for 5.0, let us know what happens...

[Babdi]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

Okay here is the scene

CPU ~ 4.4Ghz
CPU V - 1.200 (offset option)
Speed step disabled (When enabled it does not work)
C6,C3 disabled
C1E enabled
CPU temp throttle enabled
Rest default
RAM running at 1800,1.6000 volts (stock 1600 @ 1.5 V)
With AIDA stress rig is running stable for 3 hours.


Temps
CPU -56
Core #1 76 ~ 81
Cores #2 to 4 ~ 75

Not planning to push beyond 4.4 Ghz.on stock cooler.
With 4.6 core#1 temp reach 90 at 1.3 volts

Will try higher clocks once I have my H-100 in place.

Once I max out on CPU OC will try to push RAM to 2000~2400 Mhz
Will keep posted

[Babdi]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

I am wondering why you chose extreme 4 over extreme 6. The later has 2 PCI slots (just in case if we have to go for a SLI ) Firewire support and back panel CMOS clear button.The cost here in dollars is ~ $175 for extreme 4 and $218 for extreme 6, a mere 40$ difference.

[Babdi]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

Okay. My H-100 is back. Pushed to 4.6 Ghz stable. Core temps now at ~75. Pushing to 4.8 locks up. I should be happy with 4.6. Trying to push memory from 1800 upwards

[Babdi]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

Update
Ordered G skill sniper 1866,32 Gb RAM.

[Babdi]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

Installed 1866 32 GB G-skill sniper RAM, Oced to 2133. Check AIDA bench mark

[parsec]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

Great, and are you comparing your scores with the ones on the left? If so, what category are the results on the left for? Do you know what memory speed was used for the results on the left?

[parsec]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

I am wondering why you chose extreme 4 over extreme 6. The later has 2 PCI slots (just in case if we have to go for a SLI ) Firewire support and back panel CMOS clear button.The cost here in dollars is ~ $175 for extreme 4 and $218 for extreme 6, a mere 40$ difference.

Quite simple actually, I ruined a socket 775 board I was using, and wanted a replacement, but did not want to spend the money on an expensive board.

A local PC retailer, Micro Center, had one of their usual deals, the ASR Z77 EX 4 for $90 when purchased with an i5-3570K for $190. So the total for both was $280. Quite a deal, and I'm not lying about the prices.

The EX 4 has the CMOS clear button on the back panel too. Firewire does not matter to me, I have it on other PCs, but I don't have any devices that use it.

[Babdi]

Re: Z77 Extreme 6

Notice the speed in the screen shot against memory type. it runs at 2134 Mhz.
One more thing, my memory shows 31.9 GB usable. Why does it shows so. It used to show full memory with AMD rig. Is it because XMP ?